Talk:Season 4/@comment-455481-20200116223656/@comment-38698074-20200125001130

>Scarlet Gigantitan played with cars in Heroes Day ?

Yes.

> But I doubt Hawk Moth even cared about him enough to press him to follow Ladybug and Cat Noir. After all he wanted them to come at him, so he could trick them.

No. It was just the last fase if they get to pass through the Scarlet Army, which wouldn’t had even happened if all of Paris hadn’t work together to fight against the Scarlet Akumas, unless you’re going to tell me that Hawk Moth actually planned all along that his Scarlet Army would be stopped by Parisians all along.

Allow me to doubt that.

> Plus, he definitely wouldn't let Princess Justice and Verity Queen to use their potentially powers to reveal the truth on Lila, because then Lila could say under their spell that : "One of the reasons for why I got Marinette expelled is because Gabriel Agreste promised me to make me his model", in which case Gabriel just exposed himself too.

That sound way too overly specific to being with. As showing intentionality instead of the actual success that was happening at the moment.

> He got Fu's identity after using Mayura to revive the Sentimonster, but the thing is, if he wouldn't used Mayura in Feast ( and in any other occasion post Heroes Day ), then Nathalie wouldn't been as sick and probably wouldn't failed as Catalyst and he would've won in Ladybug because of Lila's stunt.

BS. Nathalie has been overly ill since Mayura, and assuming the overuse of the Peacock Miraculous is the reason why Nathalie can’t be Catalyst anymore and not since it’s first usage it’s not but headcanon, even more when there’s no way to measure how much the Peacock affects Nathalie because, as Mayura, she seemingly remains in the same condition as she was when she used the Peacock Miraculous for the first time.

And even you said previously that this was Plot Armor.

> It took him 3 seasons to get an advantage over Ladybug, Lila needed half an episode to get her defeated.

Because Lila never defeated Ladybug, she defeated Marinette.

Hawk Moth never seek Marinette, he aimed for Ladybug.

That’s why secret identities are so important in this show, you know? Hawk Moth can’t defeat Ladybug by telling the director of her school that she pushed him down stairs.

It would a funny to watch, though.

> His akumatized villains very often disobeys his orders

The only ones I can think about are Robustus, Christmaster and Riposte. The other ones may take their own decisions in how to handle things, but always with the mind to follow up with Hawk Moth’s deal.

> And do you really want to believe that it was too hard for Hawk Moth to think that if he abuses his son psychically and emotionally and then put him to kill the love of his life, Cat Blanc might turn on him ?

I mean...

Chat Blanc did aimed his Mega Cataclysm at Ladybug at first and ended up killing them both because he was unable to choose sides.

So he had a clear shot, but missed regardless.

> His plan to get Marinette akumatized wasn't bad, but his plan to corrupt his son was and it ended very bad for him ( and everyone ).

I didn’t tell you that it was necessarily good, but for a last resort after being tracked down, it was that or nothing. It turned out to be the less of the later, good try regardless.

> And if Lila gets exposed by herself, then yeah, Hawk Moth would definitely akumatize her again, but I don't see why he would intentionally try to expose her

It’s not per se about exposing Lila, but creating an Akumatized powerful enough through the desire of that person to do so.

> he's better using her to manipulate the people he knows are close to Ladybug ( aka the part time heroes which were revealed in Miracle Queen ).

First off, this assumes that Hawk Moth has that of a brain to connect the dots.

Now, seriously speaking, this assumes that Hawk Moth thinks that there’s actually a close relation between Ladybug and the one that were entrusted as temporary Miraculous holders, which might seem obvious at first, but the truth being that he has no way to know how Ladybug chooses the ones she entrusts with a Miraculous. For all he knows, Chloé is hated by everybody yet Ladybug handed her back the Bee Miraculous even after she endangered civilian lives and got Akumatized the first time she used it, and he also knows that there are (Actually, is) temporal Miraculous Holders that weren’t chosen by Ladybug, such as King Monkey.

‘Sides, turning the temporal Miraculous holders against Ladybug would only make seek for other Holders, which is rather pointless. Keeping the “Miraculer” fashion plan, regardless of the benefits works way better if anything.

> And Hawk Moth can't decide what powers his victims get

I never said otherwise.

> Plus, Lila can say that she gets pills to control her disease and because this is not real life and a kid's show

Like... For what’s the matter, a school should have a prescription for that. And like, pulling stuff like this isn’t that much of valid point.